Highlights on the collaboration between France/EU and South Africa and future challenges

An interview with Professor Samuel Elmaleh, Counsellor, Head of Cooperation at the Embassy of France in South Africa

In the occasion of the last international conference jointly organised by BELIEF and the CHPC in Johannesburg, South Africa, the BELIEF coordination team, with the support of Dr. Bruce Becker of the Meraka Institute (the interviewer), had the opportunity and pleasure to run an interview with Prof. Samuel Elmaleh. Several issues were addressed in order to have a deeper understanding of the actual collaborations between France/EU and South Africa, the challenges that South Africa is facing and the great collaboration opportunities that this amazing country offers to its European counterparts.
The interview was held in French and has been translated and reported in its entirety in English below.
Interviewer: Considering the success of Wisdom IST initiative in South Africa, why did you chose South Africa as partner for collaboration in this research area and which benefits brought this project?
Samuel Elmaleh: There are several reasons. The first one is that South Africa is a partner with scientific capacities similar to most northern countries: South Africa, at least for France, is not a developing country partner but a partner with similar scientific potentials as in Europe and/or in North America. It clearly appears that South Africa needs a cooperation based on excellence enabling South Africa to be a major player of the European Research Area. However, South Africa is challenged by a painful human resources scarcity. In order to alleviate the problem, all our programmes include a “capacity building” component (ie: strengthening of capacities, human resources training). You mentioned earlier the projects in the framework of SAFeTI (South African French Programme for Information and Communications Science & Technology). Most of the funded projects significantly contribute to capacity building. We are therefore involved in a double entry cooperation simultaneously focused on excellence and capacity building which enables to induce high-level research and academical cooperation.
Interviewer: How are bi-lateral projects between France and South Africa integrated into the system of the projects organised between South Africa and the European scale (ERA), in particular the FP7 projects and how do you collaborate with the other Embassies in bi-lateral projects in South Africa?
Samuel Elmaleh: Most of the programmes that we support, if not their totality, are designed to set up Franco-South African networks easily becoming Euro-South African that facilitate the submission of projects to the Framework Programme. A few examples will clarify this concept. The first programme, which is a rather an old one, called Protea belonging to, according to the jargon of the French ministry for foreign affairs, the category of Hubert Curien Partnership, enables to support two-year projects in any discipline. These projects are considered successful when they open the path to a European project. Obviously, a two-year project per se does not have enough time to integrate a European project.
We therefore facilitate the integration of the South African teams to the European networks of their French partners. We have another programme called SAFe Water (South African French Programme on Water Science and Technology) composed of four-year projects involving a high number of partners on both sides. Its main objective is to create perennial French-South African networks on a well defined project, then to facilitate the inclusion into ERA to finally crystallize on a successful European project. It is then obvious that with ERA-oriented programmes, we support the EU collaboration with South Africa.
Concerning the second part of your question related to our relationships with the others Embassies, of course we are coordinated. At the European level, the Science and Technology working group is coordinated by the Finnish Embassy. We are also coordinated with Germany which has similar programmes or with Italy in the field of grid-computation or in the synchrotron applications. I would say that each country brings its own sensitiveness. For instance, interested in ICT for development and its consequence on local governance, while feel closer to research, development and technological innovation in ICT. Even if the coordination could appear insufficient, efforts for a better harmonisation should be counterbalanced by the need of a healthy diversity.
Interviewer: So, is this not only for the sciences domain or also for the cultural one?
Samuel Elmaleh: Well, in the cultural domain things are slightly different. As you might be aware a network called
EUNIC (European Network of Institute for Culture) has its headquarters in Europe, while local clusters can be set up by the founding members. The cluster can then admit associated members which are other European institutions than the founders. EUNIC, at least in the approach of the Delegation, targets essentially a cultural cooperation involving capacity building and strengthening of infrastructures in South Africa.
On the other hand, South Africa is a country of vibrant culture with world-renowned artists, capable operators, international events and an interested public. South Africa is essentially willing to promote its art and culture throughout the world and to welcome on its soil cultural diversity. This means again that South Africa needs not a cooperation exclusively designed for developing countries.
Interviewer: what does your embassy does to promote the regional collaboration in the Sub-Saharan Africa, through e-Infrastructures?
Samuel Elmaleh: At the infrastructures level, investments and collaborations have been established, as several of these infrastructures benefit from fundings issued by the French Agency for Development (AFD) which operates at a regional level. Now, as far as the cooperation in science and technology is concerned, unfortunately not much is being done and we are still operating on a bi-lateral approach. Hopefully, our various programmes will be extended to other countries in the region. But still, it is very unlikely that this could be implemented in the short term.
Interviewer: Are there other bi-lateral projects between Sub-Saharan Africa (such as Namibia, Botswana, etc.) and France?
Samuel Elmaleh: Well, no, the problem is that we have to understand the structure of the French bi-lateral cooperation. France has official S&T cooperation, coordinated by an Attaché for Science and Technology, in countries whose scientific capabilities are well established. South Africa is one of them and its achievements in S&T are well acknowledged throughout the world. However, an unofficial cooperation is carried out with the other Southern African countries by the CNRS, IRD, CIRAD and French universities.
Interviewer: But is this possible through the activities of French agency for development (AFD)?
Samuel Elmaleh: Well, the French agency for development is principally interested in development in the conventional sense of the term which includes infrastructures, big fundings, sustainable development, energy, etc. As far as trainings is concerned, the AFD is interested in some fields, for instance in water management.
Interviewer: We have noticed a qualitative evolution in the collaboration between Europe and South Africa in the sense that previously collaborations were performed between individuals while they are now performed between institutes and infrastructures. Would you like to comment on this?
Samuel Elmaleh: Yes. In South Africa collaboration between individuals has been the basis of cooperation and it is still strong, at least with the UK, but it is evolving. As you may be aware, we have, in this country, a representative of the CNRS which is the principal institution for research in France, a representative of the IRD (Institute of research for development) and we have a representative of CIRAD (International centre of agronomical research for development). Their presence induces a strong cooperation between institutions, independently of the institutional relation between governments. Moreover the Embassy, along with the DST, encourages institutional
collaboration. It is clear that an institute like the CNRS has its own logics. We are informed of their agreements
with the National Research Foundation, but we cannot control their cooperation .
Interviewer: And do you wish to make any changes or is it working well this way?
Samuel Elmaleh: Absolutely no. Each entity has its own logic. At the end of the day putting everything together create a more robust cooperation because diverse and complex.
Interviewer: In your work in South Africa, which obstacles have you identified to implement the e-Infrastructures, to gain benefits from them, and what have you done to overcome this obstacles?
Samuel Elmaleh: Some difficulties were met at the very beginning: for example French researchers can ignore the resources available in South Africa and feel shy in cooperating with this country. As soon as they discover South African facilities and peers they change their mind. INRIA, for instance, has a relatively important collaboration with North Africa, West Africa and is now starting collaborating with South Africa. In fact, when INRIA met the South African teams in the occasion of a seminar to launch the programme SAFeTI they completely changed their approach.
Interviewer: And I think that the French Embassy has instruments to voice what happens in South Africa and support the enlargement of knowledge focussing particularly on French researchers.
Samuel Elmaleh: Yes, well, what we usually do, once the DST and ourselves identify a domain where it would be interesting to have a collaboration, is bringing French researchers and their South African counterparts into a brainstorming. It generally works very well because French researchers discover a research of high quality as well as a lot of potentials, while young South Africans appear very interested in spending some time in Europe and then coming back with new expertise.
Interviewer: So we are now talking about more possibilities than obstacles?
Samuel Elmaleh: Indeed. There are no real obstacles. The only difficulties, as I said earlier, are related to an unawareness of the South African offer by some French researchers. And this obstacle is overcome quite quickly. We also have to say that on the South African side, the DST is so efficient and so active that there cannot be difficulties on the South African side!
Interviewer: This is good to hear! Thinking to the future, what emerging scientific applications do you consider as having priority for the EU collaboration with South Africa?
Samuel Elmaleh: I would say that two domains seem to have priority. The first domain, and this is evident, is the one which will be linked to radio-astronomy. There are two possibilities: South Africa may or may not win the bid for the Square Kilometre Array. If it wins it, the needs in terms of signal treatment, materials, communication are going to be such that all fields surrounding radio-astronomy will become of utmost importance. But if South Africa does not win, the many efforts placed in Astronomy and Space Sciences will make of these fields a forefront for the development of the country. The second point which seems very interesting is that this country has deployed huge means for the benefits of research development even if, so far, this country does not necessarily obtain in return the expected commercial interests. We are often talked of the technological chasm which affects South Africa. Therefore an adequate cooperation domain concerns innovation management (ie: how to pass from an idea born in the laboratory to a commercial application). And this is not something which can be done in the short term. Financial means as well as regulatory means are necessary.
Interviewer: Last question: Grids have generated high interest in several Sub-Saharan African countries. Is it necessary to establish a mechanism which would coordinate the development of e-Infrastructures in the Sub-Saharan Africa in order to avoid a fragmentation and which role France could play by implementing such a mechanism of coordination?
Samuel Elmaleh: I think that Europe should coordinate the activities of the different countries in the e-Infrastructures sectors. It appears very clearly the importance of having a very precise cartography (mapping) of the e-Infrastructures in order to understand who can do what. Europe can be present as an advisor, but I think that South Africa and Africa in general should organise their proper coordination to manage the e-Infrastructures. Another point which shall be taken into consideration is the fact that, companies and/or research institutes need the cloud computing or use servers which are not necessarily visible to our eyes and Africa will have the possibility to avail of the experience which Europe already gained in this sector.
Interviewer: Do you think that there is an African structure able to carry out such a role? The parliament maybe or even the SAGrid?
Samuel Elmaleh: Nowadays, considering how Africa is structured, I would say either the Council of ministries or this could come from the initiative of one of the most advanced countries (for example South Africa). I know very well that every time that South Africa take an initiative in this domains the other countries say “fine but before we go ahead let’s be careful, etc…” but I think that this is part of the game. South Africa is well ahead of the other countries and the other African countries should take advantage of this. I say take advantage but not suffer from it. But this should be decided through a series of dialogues between South Africa and the other African countries.
Interviewer: Do you, then, think that someone should take the responsibility to promote the idea of e-Infrastructures throughout the continent?
Samuel Elmaleh: Well you know, each time something incredible has happened in the history (we can think about the discovery of America, the adjustment of the world finance, informatics) one man or some men where necessary to encourage and support the events. It is thus vital that, somewhere in Africa or in South Africa (South Africa is still Africa), some persons stand up saying: “here is what we can do together, here are the potential consequences, who is going to give us the political power to do it?”.
Interviewer: Could you please give us your opinion concerning the new service of external actions of the European Union and how do you think this could evolve in the system of bilateral collaboration with the European scale (this may be linked to one of the questions asked earlier).
Samuel Elmaleh: I think this is the normal evolution of the Commission and then of the European Union. In a few years will the different member states of the European Union need to have or will have a foreign policy? Will they still need to have a common position? Are we going to have a European Union president elected through the universal suffrage?… We do not know yet. But what is very clear is that today, the scientific services of the French Embassy, of the Italian Embassy, of the British High Commission do what is in their possibilities. This said, all these countries are all linked by an adventure which goes beyond our control which is the European adventure. We know that the European Union still has many challenges to face. The unification procedure is expensive and that the return on investment is not necessarily at the level of what has been invested. But there is a mechanism for this story. History has changed and single European countries cannot count that much anymore in the world scale. Which are the two countries who are going to count the most on the economic and thus the technological
and thus the cultural futures of our countries? USA and China. If all European countries stay together, they constitute a certain power. If they split, they become marginal. So I believe that one day, we will have a unified scientific and technological service of the European Union level and that it will not be necessary anymore to have a service in the Embassy of France of Italy etc. Eventually, this unified service will lead the policy of the European attractiveness and will lead the policy of the European unified technological cooperation. We hope that this procedure will not take us/EU a long time to become reality.
Interviewer: Maybe this evolution will play the role of a catalyst and will accelerate this implementation?
Samuel Elmaleh: Yes perhaps, we will see! What can be said is that today, the political power which has been granted to the European Union is a political power which has given with one hand what it has removed with the other hand.
Interviewer: Well on these note and thoughts, we thank very much, again, Prof. Elmaleh for his time and interest and wish to the Zero-In readers a very inspiring read!